#86 Challenging the paranormal norm in society: Wynne Thornley interview

Your eyes will be opened to another perspective about the paranormal world around us. In this interview, Wynne Thornley, an esoteric guide from Alberta Canada, shares how she normalises the paranormal world around us by offering alternative learning pathways through her haunted field trips and expanding your psychic abilities in ways you never thought possible. 
Wynne shares paranormal encounters she has had since childhood including the spirit who said ‘I’m sorry” and the illusive hat man. 

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Website:      https://www.wynnethornley.com/
Instagram:  https://www.instagram.com/thedarksideoflightwork/

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Transcript

Speaker 1: Anna Schmidt (Host)  

Hello and welcome to Perfectly Paranormal episode 86

My name is Anna Schmidt, and I'm here every week to share with you true paranormal encounters and information about devils, demons and dark energy beings that no one else talks about. Today, today we are speaking with Wynne Thornley, an esoteric guide from Alberta Canada, shares how she normalises the paranormal world around us by offering alternative learning pathways through her haunted field trips and expanding your psychic abilities in ways you never thought possible. Wynne shares paranormal encounters she has had since childhood including the spirit who said ‘I’m sorry” and the illusive hat man. 
 So let’s get into our interview with Wynne…

 Thank you for joining us today, Wynne.  

 Speaker 2: Wynne Thornley (Guest)

Well, thank you for reaching out. I'm so happy to be here with you today, Anna. 

 Speaker 1: Anna Schmidt (Host)  

I've listened to your podcast many, many times, and it's nice to connect with other paranormal podcasters. And I really like what you do because you take a different approach to the way that most paranormal people work when it comes to working with spirits and some of the other entities around us. So would you like to share with us what you do, how you got into the paranormal, what your sort of first experiences were, what made you passionate about the paranormal? 

 Speaker 2: Wynne Thornley  Guest)

My name is Wynne Thornley. I am an Alberta girl, so I'm from Canada and I've lived in central Alberta most of my life. What I like to do in the world of the paranormal is I'm all about demystification and education.

I also do have a private clientele that I do see, but when I work with them, early in my career I got over just talking to loved ones and I expanded out into more soul work. And mentorship and connecting one back with, you know, heavens and earth. We all have these abilities and that's what I found by getting into this professionally is, oh, wait, it's not actually just gifted people.

We're all gifted if we learn how to use our gifts, right? So how this all started, I mean, I was one of those people that can't remember not having paranormal experiences.  I had a mentor tell me once that my light shines so bright and I could see so much that society and my parents had no choice but to turn it off.

I went through a mental illness diagnosis that turned out to be nothing at the end of the day. And I talk about that on my podcast a little bit and some other stuff. But where I became passionate was, I was just trying to understand what was happening to me when I was a kid. I was trying to understand why, why is the world so loud and sharp for me?

Why do I have these experiences when nobody else is having it? And I just, I started to find out what was really happening in the beginning. I started to watch those ghost hunter shows, you know, like in around myself, discovery is when like paranormal state was out and then ghost hunters. And, but something didn't feel right.

Something didn't feel, it felt really Hollywood. And I didn't think, you know, Oh, I don't have those gifts like that. Well, it turned out I did. I had a mediumship experience where I was picked out of a crowd. They basically said, you need to get off some medication. You're gifted. You need those gifts to wake back up again.

And it was again, shortly after that, all of a sudden courses start to be put in front of my face. That made sense. I learned how to control my energy. And that's where the passion lies is everybody has this ability with a little bit of education. You can demystify most. Paranormal stuff. And I didn't see that happening in the industry.

So, like everybody else, we, we start in a certain path, right? And then it's like, that doesn't make sense, but I don't really care for how they're doing that. And I'm not experiencing it the same way. So that's why I continue. That's why I've changed the way I interact with the paranormal. I changed the way I teach it. I even changed the way I teach things like Reiki and stuff. This is not weekend warrior stuff. This is lifestyles. 

 Speaker 1: Anna Schmidt (Host)  

And I can understand what you were saying about the mental health issues, because I came from a mental health background with my parents. One parent, both sides of her family had very strong mental health issues. And I never told anyone about my seeing, feeling, hearing, knowing, sensing. Because I was worried that I was going to be put on medication and I didn't want that. So I kept it to myself for most of my life until I was an adult. And I couldn't hold it in anymore and it just sort of all started coming out.

It's interesting how we challenge people, isn't it? When we do, when we do the paranormal thing a different way than is seen through society as being acceptable, because it's, it's kind of acceptable, but it's not acceptable, but it's acceptable if you do it the way everybody else does. 

Speaker 2: Wynne Thornley  Guest)

You know, and I couldn't agree more with that. And I've been somebody who's always rubbed people the wrong way. And even though, especially if I'm just being myself, and I have found a lot of shade in the business as well due to my, but tell me more about that. Explain to me that a little bit differently. You know, like I want to know why you're teaching what you're teaching and where did you learn it?

And when those answers can't come, these people get really triggered.  It's like, well, I'm just asking questions. So that's something that I definitely let bleed into all of my, any, any educational experience I offer is you better be challenging me too, because guess what? I don't know everything either.

And I have found some students have helped shift my perspective just with their questioning, because then I had to question what I learned and why I believed what I believed. Right. I used to have this strong feeling about angels. They are these beings. And I had this one student question me, she said, I just can't get on it. I just can't get on that bandwagon. I feel like it's energetic spheres and I was like, Whoa, like it changed my complete perspective where I played in that energy a little bit. What if they aren't this being that's outside of us that comes to us and it's a sphere within us that radiates out. Ooh, I like that, right?

So I think it's important, and if anything we've learned in our paranormal experiences is that they're subjective, but when information changes, we have to run with the change, just like science. You know what I mean? Like, it's not tangible, but we can make it tangible if we continue to look at it under a microscope and allow it to change, allow our viewpoints to change And try something new.  

 Speaker 1: Anna Schmidt (Host)   

That's it. And it's how tangible you actually want to make it. Because I find it's very tangible. And when I've worked with a lot of my clients who are now becoming more aware because they're not so frightened, they're not so scared of the paranormal anymore. And I picked up a house clearing job the other day from a friend who went to a friend's home and went, I don't know what's going on in that room.

And she said, I don't know why I'm always angry in that room. It's her son's bedroom and it's always messy. I mean, his little kids are messy sometimes, but the mum goes in there and she's angry. Her whole personality changes in that particular room. And my friend went, Ah, I think you need to see Anna.  So I've just finished that job.

And it was interesting because it was an old schoolhouse. And the headmaster was still there and the mum would hear, shh, all the time. So that's all been sorted now. So it'd be interesting to see, I only finished that job yesterday. Give the house a week. I talk to the clients, see how they're going, what's changed. And the husband's very sceptical and the wife didn't tell him she was having the house cleared. It'd be interesting to see if he notices and getting onto sceptics. How do you handle sceptics? I find them, I find them interesting and I find them a challenge, but I actually enjoy working with them.  

 Speaker 2: Wynne Thornley  Guest)

I also enjoy working with them because again, challenge me on my beliefs and I'll tell you where this information comes from. I'll tell you why I'm connected into it and how I see the proof in my life. And you know, and I'm happy to have the conversation because they do make me think in a different way. Right? Yes. It's okay to be challenged. And then it's okay. I mean, at the end of the day, I end up saying, Hey, it's okay with whatever you believe in. I believe in this stuff. You believe in that stuff. But next time we want to have a conversation, like I'm approachable. 

 Speaker 1: Anna Schmidt (Host)   Speaker 2: Wynne Thornley  Guest)

Yeah. And I always find that sometimes skeptics, they aren't ready. They aren't ready to understand it, or they've got family beliefs or religious beliefs. Don't want it to be part of their reality because it means they have to manage something else in their lives. And they've already got their plates are already full up to here. And they just can't cope with thinking about anything else. 

 Speaker 2: Wynne Thornley  Guest)

You're taking like people who think very analytically and logically. It's very difficult for them to live in a mystical magical world where anything is possible because they need the reason why. And spirit doesn't always have that reason why it just has to be, to experience, to witness.  Right. So to question ourselves. 

 Speaker 1: Anna Schmidt (Host)   

Yeah and I've worked on clients homes who were totally skeptical and they're like, there's change. It's good change. I'm still not a believer. I'm going to sit on the fence.  That is totally okay because if I've helped them and made an improvement in their life. That's what the job's about. It's not about them going, I believe you and paranormal is real. If you've made that change, just go with it. Just go with that flow.  

 Speaker 2: Wynne Thornley  Guest)

That's right. Because it's not up to me to decide when people wake up or when people have these moments of shifting of saying, maybe there is something out there. I had one client, I had one skeptic that hired me. The house was for sale for three years, right? But, and the job in Australia, they actually moved to Australia. And the job, it wasn't waiting for him anymore, right? So they had to get going and hired in a cleanser. He said that he thought I painted his walls.

That's how he, because he's like, it's so much brighter in here. So did you mean by cleaning, like you came in and painted the walls? Is that what you mean? And I'm like, If that's how you need to see it, sure, energetic painting, but yes, right? Cause that's how he could explain it to himself. Oh, well, she must've meant something different. She came in and washed, like washed my walls or painted my walls. Right. 

 Speaker 1: Anna Schmidt (Host)  Speaker 

Yeah. I always say to people, you can, can remove the carpet, you can add new furniture, but you have to have an energetic spring clean of your home every now and again, it has to be energetically done if you choose to, but it makes a huge difference.

Now, I'm interested in what was your first major paranormal experience that made you go, wow, this is real. I like this. You know, this is something I can work with. 

 Speaker 2: Wynne Thornley (Guest) The spirit said ‘I’m sorry’ story

You know, that didn't happen as far as a positive aspect of it until I was an adult. But the first time I remember being different and having an actual experience that I knew others wouldn't understand was I was very young, maybe five, six, I had a water bed and that's part, you know, it's part of the story here. So I woke up from this nightmare and I heard, it was like a little boy saying, I'm sorry, I'm sorry for that. I'm sorry I scared you. Right? So it was like, I'm sorry. And then I felt him sit down on the edge of my bed because the whole bed rippled. And I hung on to that for a long time, not telling anybody because before I had started to tell my mom that I was hearing footsteps down the hallway.

And my parents would say, oh, well, that's just the house settling or it's pipes and it didn't feel like the energy didn't feel right to me. But when that moment happened. When I woke up, heard, I'm sorry, felt the bed ripple. I'm like, I can't make that up, but I've already been told to not talk about this.  I don't want to hear about that.

Right. And then that gaslighting that parents do unknowingly, they don't mean to do it, but it scares them when they start hearing their children say, Hey, I heard something coming down the hallway, or I saw somebody standing in my doorway. So I'd say the first time I said, yes, I was comfortable. It wasn't scary for me.

I was very young, five, six years old.  And, um, after that, I was very choosy about who I shared this information with, even knowing that young, because again, I think I've been like a hypersensitive. I'm empathic. I was always able to read people's feelings behind the broad like they're putting out a broadcast, but I could always feel there's something not matching what they're saying.

So. It's just something that's always been within me. So I've been very choosy. Now, as an adult, where I went, Ooh, I kind of like this was my first Reiki class when I went, Huh, I've been doing this my whole life and it's not wrong and it's not bad. And Oh my gosh, I can do something really cool with this.

Now. You know, when I first got my level one, at first I was very, very selfish. I'm like, Oh, this is just for me. Like this feels so good. This is just for me. But spirit has a way, doesn't it? Right? All of a sudden people, you look so good. What are you doing? Oh, I want some of that too. And it wasn't long before I started to have people wanting sessions. So as an adult, yeah, definitely getting ranking and having, Oh, this is something, this is really something.  

 Speaker 1: Anna Schmidt (Host)  

So you take people on paranormal tours, so would you like to tell us about how you work and some of the experiences? 

  Speaker 2: Wynne Thornley (Guest)

So at first, people assume, they assume they're coming on a paranormal investigation. So there's a little bit of education around it to begin with. I've lovingly called these tours haunted field trips. And the places I choose to take people to are public places. Anybody can access them anytime, but it's also about connecting the history to the metaphysics that are happening because it's all connected.

So for an example, my first tour was at a place called Frank Slide, which is a major, uh, historical mountain that's in Southern Alberta. So, Frank's slide involves the falling of a part of a mountain into a mining settlement that's at the bottom of the Turtle Mountain. Now, a lot of people, when you look on the Internet, there's a lot of information about the whole town was covered, blah, blah, blah. That's already stuff that we demystify as soon as we get there. 

Okay. And I actually take these people to the base of the slide so we can actually tune in to the site itself without any beepers, without any boopers, because we are our own beeper booper. We are the best antenna to pick up paranormal experiences. 

So, when people first say, Oh, I'm actually doing it, they're nervous. They don't believe that they could tap in, yet every single one of them has a unique experience when I take them through. It's a meditation style where I allow them to be a witness and not to connect and attach to the energy because that's how we get confused and conflicted within the paranormal.

We involve our emotions and our filters. So here I said, No, you're just a witness. What are you witnessing? What does this mountain have to say to you? What does this site have to say to you? And everybody gets something a little bit different. So after that meditation portion, all of a sudden the crowd eases.

They're excited about learning more. They're not scared anymore because they rarely pick up anything also that is  traumatic to the point where it's hard for them to accept it. And this is where we allow ourselves to not see through things emotionally or through those filters. So when they realize, oh, it's not scary, then I take them to another portion and we say, okay, well, why would this place be haunted?

Frank's Slide, for example, there are seams and seams and seams of coal running up in that mountain. There are major underground water sources there, which talks a lot about telluric fields, you know? So it does feel spooky. It feels spooky over 100 years ago, a whole part of the mountain came down and took out part of a, a town just how people talk about that area gives a psychic impression and residual energy onto it.

They build it. So we talk about that stuff. I mean, even just down from Frank, since we're Frank slide is just a really good example, because it's very, uh, there's 3 different sites that we attend that give very different energy at every site. And that's also why I want these people to understand. We could be within a mile of a place and they feel miles apart in energy.

So, when we go up into the Hillcrest Cemetery, which I love going to cemeteries, I love going to graveyards. There's a lot of demystification that can happen in those sites as well. This particular cemetery involves 187 lives that were lost in the worst mining disaster of Canadian history at the Hillcrest Mines, which happened within a decade of Frank's slide.

So, this whole area just has this trauma pause, but when you Oh, into it. I find these attendees are finding the community that rushed in to help save those who were buried wives and other families that had lost their main breadwinner in the minds. You feel a different sort of connection there and you can actually, they honour these sites a little bit better instead of being like, oh, I'm so scared to go into that cemetery.

Now they're actually really curious.  And they want to honour the lives that were once there. And then we usually finish off the tour with the information centre, or the museum that's attached to all of this. And with Frank, there's so much validation by people wandering around because their interpretive centre is, it's three levels of gloriousness. 

They have old buildings that were once part of the town in there. They've got histories, they've got even the scientific facts about why the mountain fell, why it happened. And even the indigenous and how they warned the settlers, we would never stay there. That's the mountain that moves. What are you guys doing?

So through not only education of the historical happenings there on these haunted field trips, we talk about the history. We talk about what's going on with the earth energies here. Are there any ley lines, vortexes? Is there high mineral content? Is there a lot of telluric fields underneath the ground? Because there's reasons why we feel this way. So we discussed that. Then we allow this expansion of the psychic senses. I call it ghost hunting from a medium's perspective, right? Yes. 

And we allow this psychic development to happen in a real world condition because the one thing I was finding, Anna, is over the last probably seven years of teaching classes on channeling, Reiki, spiritual development, when you're all in a community center together, everything's amplified, everything is safe.

Yes. But then these people struggle to do it in an actual on site place where there's a lot of energy and feels going on.  So this is like ghost hunting from a medium's perspective in real world circumstances where you are not in control of everything. And we do it in the daylight. Can you believe it? I don't have to do dead time.

We don't have to be in there at three o'clock, three o'clock in the morning. Like these are paranormal investigations, Anna. These are healing experiences that these people are having. And it jacks me up because they're seeing it. They're taking away the Hollywood and they're like, Oh yeah, but that makes sense.

Yeah. When you put these two things together, when you put the logic and the spiritual together, yeah, it makes sense. Why people would feel the heebie jeebies running through the crow's nest pass. That's where Frank slide is like, it makes sense. Or this fall, I'm taking a group of people to the Empress theater, which is in Fort McLeod, one of Alberta's establishing towns.

This theater is over a hundred years old. And it does vaudeville still it does classes. It does film. It does. So it still has that variety, but the energy soaked into the walls, just like you said, you could repaint it. You could take the seats out. You could take the carpet out. But that building has so much so many stories to tell. And not once did any of those people who came to that event, did they feel scared at all? They never felt scared. 

 The Empress Theatre spirit story

We often heard children laughing. The owner there has such a presence. Like I can't even explain it. I remember he comes up to me. He's like, what are you doing? I've never seen, what are you doing? Can you see me? I can see you. And he's having this conversation with me and I'm trying to run this group in a meditation, right? But anything else I've seen in this theater is always been filmed and Tell me if you're here, make the beeper go off. So when this, you know, this presence comes up to me, he's like, I've never seen it done this way before.

What are you doing? Can they see me? Like there was this curiousness, even in spirit of saying something different is going on here. So I really, I didn't see anything like this in, especially in my province. But I was really, really, I mean, at the end of the day, my intention is to say, let's take the Hollywood out of the paranormal and let's normalize it a little bit.

And these people are coming away with way less fear.  Some skeptics who have come had said, wow, I never really thought about this stuff this way. And you've opened up a whole new world to me. Like, I would do this again. I thought I was going to be scared. I thought this, I thought that. And I'm like, well, I hope you had a good time. 

So it's been a really cool last 3 years where I was able to start to put those into motion. Because when I first had the intuition, it was 2020. So I had to wait. I had no choice but to wait. Which is fine. We're doing good now that way, but yeah, so that's what happens on those haunted field trips. And I want people to think about it like a field trip.

This is educational. So what kind of inspired these Anna was I've been on my fair share of ghost walks. I've been on my fair share of ghost tours. And the thing that I find. Disappointing is how many fallacies they still tell about these places, just stories that were either made up that are carried through the collective consciousness for whatever reason and they just reiterate it. And a lot of these buildings, you don't even get to go inside. So you're taking me on this street tour. I'm not allowed to go inside. I get to a point where I can't trust half of the stuff they're saying because my own research already disproves half of what some of these ghost tour people are actually saying.

And they're trying to keep a collective narrative, a collective narrative that needs to change. So that's what I'm hoping to do with haunted field trips, because the collective narrative around the paranormal, it needs to change. Paranormal just means it's not normal. So let's figure out what it really means.That's kind of my point of view around it, right? 

 Speaker 1: Anna Schmidt (Host)  

That's right. That's why I called my podcast Perfectly Paranormal because it's perfectly normal. Like my tagline is life is perfectly paranormal because we're all existing together. And I wrote a note with what you were saying. We, when we do our work, with connecting with who is around us, we don't have to prove they're there.

Paranormal Investigation is all about the proof, and proving there are spirits there. They're everywhere. Day, night, afternoon, morning. They don't come out at night time. They are in locations 24 7. If it's for a particular reason or if they're roaming spirits, they come, they go.  People say to me, you know, why do I get these feelings coming and going in my house? I say because spirits are literally roaming the earth. They will wander into your house, have a look at you and go, Oh, isn't that lovely? And then they go again. Yeah. They just, they move around all the time. It's the same with the darker entities that I work with.  They're here for different reasons, but they come and go, and they, they are here all the time, and our, our, like the angelic realm, and our realm, and the, the spirit realm, it's all, it's all one, it's not separated, it is all one location, like multiple dimensions, all happening at the same time, that's how I try and explain it to people.

 Speaker 2: Wynne Thornley (Guest)

I like that analogy. It's happening all the time. I use it. It's a radio band. Yeah. You have your stations and that's where everything is.  You know, there's some people who get really, really like, and I get it because Hollywood does a really good job of saying darker entities are really scary, but Hollywood never says, but if you're aligned to the energy, it'll be attracted to you.

But if you're, if the entity is here, but you're all the way over here on the radio dial, it's, it's, It doesn't match. There's nothing to be scared of. There's nothing to be scared of. No. I mean, when people are so worried about whether it's angelic or good or evil, I'm like, try to think contributing and non contributing because what you consider evil is subjective compared to somebody else. So is it contributing or non contributing and deal with it on that level, but it's not deciding for everybody what good and evil is because you can't do that. I've learned that from being in this business. What's good and evil to me is certainly different than the person down the street from me.  

 Speaker 1: Anna Schmidt (Host)  Speaker 2: Wynne Thornley (Guest)

Well see, where I get into trouble is that I say, a lot of the time, is that dark entities, they're not evil. They actually teach us about our shadow selves, about what we need to work on within us. Because when I clear homes, entities are there because of the emotional food, the emotional vibrations. You know, emotions are energy in motion. If that makes sense. So wherever people create pools of negative emotions for whatever life traumas they're going through, that pumps out a vibration.

That vibration, say it's resentment or loneliness or, you know, hatred that attracts the lower vibrational beings that feed off that vibration. So I clear homes by removing all the negative imprints, all the trauma, all the addictions. Anything negative that's happened in a home, for whatever reason, from the previous owners, or the past owners, or on the land, what happened to the land before the home was built, and then it's got that energetic spring clean that we talked about earlier, and the entities go, eh, I'm just going to go down the street, down the pub, go wherever all the vibrations that they like are being created.

People find that challenging. I go, they're not scary. They don't actually care about you. It's what's in the home. And you just happen to sleep in that spot or brush your teeth in that spot or sit in that spot. And that's why you feel cold or you feel a bit sick or you feel unwell. I like to call it using your, you're a dowsing tool.

This is how I do a lot of pendulum dowsing. And I say to people, your body is a dowsing tool. Use it when you go out. If you go to the pub and no one sits in that cubicle and you think, I'll go and sit there. And you go over there and go, Oh, no, I start to feel sick or my head's spinning, or I just feel uncomfortable.

There's a reason why you're not meant to sit there. Honor what your body is telling you. And that is what you're teaching people is to honour what their physical body is telling them, what their mind and what their chakras and what their energy field is telling them. Yeah. And that's what these clients, this friend of mine that went to that house, where the, the shh principle was, she's really new to doing this, but she went, there's something here, there's something in that room, and I, I can understand why you're feeling rage, because I'm feeling really uncomfortable in this room.

 Speaker 2: Wynne Thornley (Guest)

Let's do something about it.  I always tell people, you know, you, you are just one shift away of not experiencing any of that stuff. You know, it even comes into, I like how you brought up shadow work and how these entities, they're, they're aligned with that resentment, that addictive energy, whatever we're putting out.

And we're creating this agreement with them to live in that stink together. But if you decide right now, I'm going to shift my energy. I'm going to change my mindset. You will never experience that again. Thank you. When I had an entity come around me quite often when I was between the ages of 7 and about 15, and collectively we call him the man in the hat or the hat man.

You've probably heard of this energy, right? And the last time I had a visit from that energy, which I'm not sure what it is. I know that for me, it created a lot of deep fear, but by then I was already told to be scared of  You okay? So there's a lot of belief around that. I had to undo. The last time I saw that energy was just before I got right key before I really stepped into managing my own energy, right?

And understanding attraction alignment. And even, uh, like I'm Teflon, I don't take on other people's stuff. I learned about that. I haven't seen it since, and I haven't seen anything like that since, unless it's removing it from somebody else's body, a home. Again, when I'm there to deal with business, to make a shift in the energy there and allow more accepting, loving, bright energy, then yeah, like I say, paint your walls.

That's the only time I see that stuff now, but it doesn't just come looking for me because there's nothing to look for. It can't live in my vibration. And, and that shadow aspect, I love how it amplifies that. If we could just look at ourselves and say, wow, what kind of rage am I hiding within me? Maybe I need to address that.

That's why our bodies tell us so much. I mean, I loved getting into the studies of the chakras and it's more than just this surface stuff that that's a lot of the energy workers teach. It's way deeper than that. You use that chakra to get you into the organ system, to get you into the nervous system or whatever system you need to get into that is aligning.

With discomfort that is aligning with non contributing energy or sabotage. And once you can address that, you see it in the body. You see it change. You see it in attitudes. All of a sudden you lose a bunch of weight and you wonder why. And it's like, well, you're no longer carrying around shame. What I'm hoping for a lot in our industry on is just this more of people who think like us.

Yes. Look beyond what Hollywood is teaching. What is my body telling me? What is this home telling me? And how is it telling me that you're aligned to all of this?  Because you're right. It's not good or bad. It's just, if it's affecting your life, you need to shift out of it, shift your perspective, shift your energy and it's just like that. Like you say, I would be very interested to hear about your client who you dealt with yesterday and to see if they've noticed a difference yet, because this stuff is very quick when, when we do make the shift and commit to it. I mean, there's been houses that I've had to revisit because the folks were so committed to being haunted that it just kept showing up haunted.

And I just said, I can't help you until you can decide to live. With ease, grace, and flow, without problems, without fear. Until you choose that, there's nothing I can do. 

 Speaker 1: Anna Schmidt (Host)  

Paranormal drama is a thing. It's like paranormal addiction, a term that I've kind of coined with my work, is people want the paranormal to frighten them. They want that adrenaline rush. Now that's okay for entertainment. That might be a movie, but when you're living it day in, day out, I find I get a lot of clients who go from healer to healer to tell their story because they're, they may have a mental health condition, or they're lonely, or they're feeling lost, or they just, they like to tell the story, but they don't actually want change.

Paranormal drama has created a real problem in our society with people getting addicted to having these entities around them. You see on Instagram and YouTube and people go, Oh, my house is haunted. And they've got 500, 000 views. Someone like me will leave a comment going, I would really like to help you and there is no response.

Speaker 2: Wynne Thornley (Guest)

Because then it would solve the situation. It would solve it. And that you're right. It's this junkie attitude, right? And they're getting, they're getting a perceived payoff, which is usually negative, but it's a perceived payoff. I get to have this story. I'm so victimized by spirit. I mean, some of, some of the stories that swirl into my world are I just, when I clear houses and this is coming from a healer's side of things, right?

I just clear houses and I'm so exhausted after and things follow me home. And I'm like, Oh, so you have no training. Okay. Oh no, but I'm a natural medium. Ah, but if things are following you home and if you're all drained out, like you should be on top of the world after a house caring. You should feel great after sending spirit back to where it needs to go and where it's most happy.

You shouldn't be drained, bringing things home, then you're not trained. And don't get mad at me because you chose not to take the training. Like, why are you suffering? But again, that's also that spiritual junkie ism of, Oh, I'm a wounded healer. Well, and they align to a certain clientele, too, and it's okay. It's okay. Because, I mean, I've learned that you're going to buy into the experience that you're most comfortable with. If you want to go and go to a show where it's horse and pony tricks, and somebody's up there saying, Who knows somebody with a name that starts with a J? Well, I'd rather go have a high level experience where I'm one on one with my spiritualist.

I'm trying to see why I'm aligning to these dark entities or because I don't think that they're evil. Again, they're just showing us more of who we are, right? They're bringing out what we need to shift up and out or accept more into our lives. If we look at angelic, it doesn't matter. Just a different end of the pole.

I'd rather have that high level experience because I'm buying and paying for the experience that's going to help me shift in him. You want a low level, then you're just dabbling. You're not serious about it. And you're, I don't know, I just feel like, I just feel like there's very few of us that are very serious about this work sometimes, Anna.

And it feels like we're up against a brick wall sometimes with all of this other showboating, spiritual junkie ism, the addiction, the flaunting the drama.  I mean, I don't know if you can relate the same way. I love the work I do. I'm going to do it as long as spirit allows me to. But do you ever feel like sometimes you're running up a hill and the hill is never going to end and it's like, but I just want to be heard a little bit more.

Like when will people wake up? I mean, I tried to have compassion for others, but I do run up into a lot of this.  It's hard to watch what's going on in the spiritual industry. Sometimes it really is for me.  It is, big time, big time. 

 Speaker 1: Anna Schmidt (Host)  

I can relate this to a client experience where a young couple moved into a home, about a hundred year old home, so that just tells me instantly, you're going to have spirits, you're going to have dark energies, you're going to have emotional imprints and so forth from the previous client. They'd had someone come in and, now I'm not doubting these two perspectives about how people do their work. They had someone come in and do some saging and drumming and charge them 120 to clear the home. Didn't do anything. Nothing shifted. They then had another lady come in who was recommended to them.

She sat in the middle of their lounge room surrounded by crystals for half an hour and chanted. And then when your house is now clear of all paranormal evil entities that have been haunting you. All that did was, peeve off the energy beings that were in the home. So then they come to me, someone else recommended to me. 

And afterwards they always come back and pay the fee, which is not exorbitant. Yeah. He was so happy with the work that I did afterwards that he left me a testimonial. He was over the moon that he'd found someone authentic and genuine. And he's like, why do you, why do you only charge this much? When she charged me that, but you've done way more for me. I said, because I don't do it for the money. The, the money, or sometimes I do it for locals, will do swaps, will swap honey, or eggs, or it's about an exchange energetically, so that it's, you're valuing what you do.

But like you said, it's hard to be seen as someone who is real, who is genuine, who is authentic. But I just keep pumping out my information that upstairs or management, as I call them, is saying, right, you need to educate people about this. You know, talking about dark entities as teachers, that was one of my episodes.And people have come back to me and gone, Oh no, you took that down the wrong track. And I'm going, no, actually it is real life, everyday information. Please do with it what you will, but you plant the seed in people's minds, even if they're skeptical.  

 Speaker 2: Wynne Thornley (Guest)

You know, that was the hardest. I love how you mentioned that, you know, the management upstairs keeps telling me what to put out and I just do it. And in the beginning, especially when I pivoted more into, well, let's talk about what makes you feel uncomfortable, right? I've lived it my whole life. I mean, let's talk about it. I had a hard time being like, well, you're telling me to put this out, but I'm scared, right? Because not only the area I live in, the group of healers I learned and teach with, I, I've been told that I scare people almost my whole life.

But I'm like, but are you sure you want me to talk about that? Like, yeah, because you know that, you know that. So go talk about that. So it's taken me a little bit, but that's how the dark side of light work came to be. It's like, I started to challenge the cases that were out there. I started to challenge the healers that we've put on pedestals for no good reason.

Right. And to break it down, people got a little upset by some of those episodes. Well, I thought you loved the Warrens. Yeah, but the more I found out about them, the less, the less I put them on pedestals. They were just real people too. So how about that? Right. And they followed a certain line that I felt is detrimental in paranormal research now that everybody learns from and I mean, that's okay.

That's my opinion. I don't care if you feel that way, but nobody ever talks about them that way. But this is my experience. I know how to do all this stuff too. I don't need the showmanship. I don't need newspapers showing up. I don't need. Movies, right? And the Warrens have been like that the whole time, which is fine.

That's their process of putting the education out there. And it took a little while for me to accept this is my process. And that's just using Warrens as an example. I mean, when we start to look at even haunted buildings, I'm like, if they were really haunted and they really wanted them to not be haunted, why are they not doing anything about it?

Well, Hotels make a lot of money when they're haunted, right?  Which really, if they were really haunted, they wouldn't make a lot of money. And that's what I think people don't understand if they were truly, truly haunted, everything else becomes affected by that, right? Like I love how some people are like, I want to live with the ghost in my house.

I'm like, but that directly affects your energy. You don't want to live with the dead. It's not natural.  Let's find them a place where they can go without attachment. 

 Speaker 1: Anna Schmidt (Host)  

Exactly. Yes. Exactly. I had a client once who was an elderly man. He'd moved into a new home. The lady who had lived in the home previously had passed away in the home and the family hadn't got around to fully clearing the house out and they put all of her possessions in the back room and locked it. 

So he moved into the house. She was still there. She was upset because no one had dealt with her precious items. Her senior sewing machine was her most favourite item. He was lonely and he knew something was in the house and he went, look, you can stay, you can stay. And that was the worst thing that he did because she was in the kitchen with him, in the shower with him, in the bedroom with him, when he was getting dressed, when he went to the pub.

She stuck to him like glue because she was a little bit lonely, he was a little bit lonely, he was tired and exhausted and he couldn't cope anymore. We ended up sorting it out, and she was happy once all her possessions were divided amongst the family and the sewing machine went to the daughter that wanted it. 

She was very upset that she'd been disrespected and everything had just been shoved aside to get the money for selling the house. But that man lived the experience of living with a spirit in his house. He was tired, he was drained, he wasn't sleeping properly, he felt uncomfortable, he knew something was there. He didn't quite know who it was. It wasn't scary, but it was annoying. So people who say, Oh, spirits, Oh, you can please stay in my house. How do you know they're spirits too? That's the other question.  

 Speaker 2: Wynne Thornley (Guest)

Yes, because if you don't have the education or the experience to check out the whole broadcast is the way I look at it. You got to look at everything coming through. There could be a hidden agenda. It could be wrapped in light. You don't know. And as soon as you give that permission, oh my goodness, you have set up a contract that is never ending. And that's the biggest problem. We don't want to live with that energy.

Because like you said, look how your client slowly declines. Yeah, it's not a vibrational match for our energy. So it'd be like living by windmills as far as I'm concerned. That's how it'd be for me if there's a lot of spirit around, but I'm hypersensitive. So I always explain that to people. You don't want to sleep right beside your electric panel downstairs.

That's why it's downstairs, right? So that's like a, like a spirit. It's the same disruption and just that permission. You don't know what else, what else is even bound to them. You don't know if they've even got something bound to them. So you could be saying yes on so many levels. Oh, my good. Like, no, I say never give permission.

You always say, get out. I'm of the living, but by, you know, back to whence you came, Okay. I'm very much an advocate of don't live with energy that's in disharmony, because you will eventually suffer from it physically, emotionally, mentally, financially, all of that, whether it's all of it or some of it, get into harmony, man. It's way, way more fun when you're in harmony, because again, it's like, do you like to tell the story that I have a friendly ghost in my house?  Is that also part of the payoff?  

 Speaker 1: Anna Schmidt (Host)  

It's been so wonderful speaking with you. Would you like to share with everyone about your social media, about how they can contact you about your haunted field trips?

 Speaker 2: Wynne Thornley (Guest)

Well, I'm not the best on social media, but I have Facebook and I do have Instagram. Those are my two favourite to play on, and I think they're really age appropriate for me. So you can find me at either the Dark Side of Lightwork with Wynne Thornley or Wynne Thornley Esoteric Guide.

I like to say I more guide people towards themselves opposed to teach them. I'm not a ma Reiki master. I'm mastering Reiki. I'm just all about, that's where you'll find that type of stuff. The lighter stuff on the Esoteric Guide and the darker, more inky stuff on the Dark Side of Lightwork. If you want to find me in one area where everything is there, my blog, event details, all that stuff, I just set up a new website.

It's www.winthornely. com. Super easy. You'll be able to find some course journals that I have there that help you manage your energy and create a routine out of it because I don't care if you're a ghost hunter, a medium or what, learn how to manage your energy, you will change your life. You will change, it then becomes a choice.

It's not something you have to deal with. It's a choice. I love mentorship. I work really well in teaching and mentorship. So I have mentorship opening up this fall and some Reiki classes, which are all done online. I live in a super small rural community. So everything I do is online because I reach out way past it.

I work with people all over the world. That's how you can find me. If you want to learn more, I'm all about consultations. We might not jive together. We might be like two peas in a pod. So I don't ever want people to commit to anything without actually, let's have a chat. Let's see if we mix and if this is the experience you're looking for. So yeah, that's me in a nutshell. I'm so glad to have been on your podcast today and I've been listening to you for a while too. So it's kind of like fangirling a little bit. I've controlled a little bit during the interview, but I'm fangirling a little bit too.  

Speaker 1: Anna Schmidt (Host)  

But it's so nice to meet someone that we have a similar approach and that we can see beyond What society wants people to see what the brainwashing that goes on and we just keep educating. I'm just going to keep working and keep making a podcast. Probably till the day I die plan on being here till I'm 96. So I've got another 40 odd years. So I'm going to be drumming it into people. And then leave it on YouTube for, for the rest of eternity so people can find it once I'm not here. But yeah, we just do it. We just keep educating, putting out that real perspective about the paranormal. Thank you for being with us today. 

 Speaker 2: Wynne Thornley (Guest)

Thank you so much for having me, Anna.

 Speaker 1: Anna Schmidt (Host)  

So, in episode 87, we are stepping into the parlour on how to contact those on the other side - what are the good practices, what to avoid and some of the negative side effects I have witnessed in clients who dabble in this type of spiritual practice whether innocently or with darker intention. Some of the commonly used practices I am mentioning today I have specifically put in the “What to avoid” section because I personally doubt their safety for some people’s mental and emotional vulnerability and I have had bad experiences or two, so don’t judge me, I am speaking from personal experience. 

Thank you for joining me today and don’t forget if you want to share your paranormal experiences or have a question, email me at spiritualbeing44@gmail.com. 

For information on paranormal house clearing visit my website:  

https://www.spiritualbe-ing.com.au/  

I look forward to sharing this spooky space with you again next week and remember life is perfectly paranormal.